Saturday, May 22, 2010

Reader's Choice/Requests on Tyranids

It's been almost two weeks since my last post. In part, I've not really managed to get a game in; last weekend things went nuts and poor communication this time around meant I lurked in a gaming store for a bit, then bought some foam for my Warmachine project.

Lately, I've been delving into the 'nids. I think I'm getting comfortable with some of the ways they play, but admittedly, I've not yet tried everything with them.

Stuff I have Used
Primes
Footslogging Melee Warriors
Tervigon/Termagant Core
Hive Guard
Tyrannofexes

These, I'm pretty comfortable with.

Stuff I have NOT used so much
Trygons
Hive Tyrants
Zoanthropes
Hormagaunts
Mycetic Spores
Biovores
Harpies
Lictors
Raveners

I'm curious to hear what readers have thought of these. Please, share experiences both in fielding them (bonus points if you provide context of lists/scenario...) and in fighting against them.

I admit I'd like to try Hormies and Raveners, and I'll EVENTUALLY get those bloody harpies converted...

Stuff I Don't Use Much, But Have A Pretty Firm Opinion ON
Spore Mines
-90pt filler/diversion, or look elsewhere

Carnifexes
-I'd not take more than a couple of 2x scything talon in a brood, if that.
-No, frag spines are NOT really worth it. The only time you really care about them is charging heaps of powerfists in cover, and powerfists will generally kill you.

Venomthropes
-Solid support, BUT only in certain builds.

Pyrovores
-....why? Competes with your honest-to-god shooty units and kills infantry. What do we have that CAN'T carve up infantry in other slots

THere are probably others.

At any rate, I'm looking to viewers/readers for inspiration here. Work's been more insane than usual, so I've got less brainpower to go around.

9 comments:

Chumbalaya said...

I've been using the same stuff as you actually, like almost exactly the same. I don't have much experience with the other stuff, but I'll let ya know if I ever do run up Trygons and Tyrants.

Raptor1313 said...

Trygons, I've tried a couple times (incidentally, with Tyrants).

My worry with Trygons is getting them in there fast enough to get any benefit out of them, Plus, when you get down to it, they are not THAT hard to torrent down in front of shooty armies, and then you've got to put omething else out there with 'em (so more reserves, and less stuff on the table to start with...what would you even put with Trygons? Raveners?)

Tyler said...

Well, this is what I have been running in 2k. (this is with the assumption that hive tyrants with wings get to deepstrike, hive commander works off table, and it stacks.. god we need a FAQ) lol.

Hive Tyrant x2 510
Dual Scything Talons
Wings
Hive Commander
Leech Life/Paroxysm

2 Zoanthropes x2 320
Mycetic Spore

Tervigon x2 360
Adrenal Glands
Toxin Sacs

10 Termagants x2 180
Mycetic Spore

Trygon x3 630
Adrenal Glands

The tervigons outflank via hive commander. I think that if all the above assumptions prove to be true after we get the FAQ, then I really like this list. I haven't played in many games with it, but those that I have, it has a whole lot of synergy, and seems to have the exact opposite playstyle you seem to have with your nids. I'll check off your list one by one:

Trygon: I really don't think walking him is going to be that great unless you have a silly amount of other targets, or your opponent has little to no ranged firepower. So I both deepstrike him, and give many other targets :D
Giving your opponent as little amount of time to react to you is key. I think they are close to be correctly priced, and adrenal glands is amazing for only 10 points. With it they munch through units before they hit you, and almost guarantee many penetrations against pretty much any vehicle. The biggest downside I have found doesn't actually have anything to do with his rules (although the tunnel pisses me off, its not a big deal) its his model. They have a beautiful model, but without cover, even T6, 6 wounds doesn't last long enough as you want it to. I use intelligent placement and mycetic spores to give me cover. (mine are the same size as a SM droppod0-which is quite large)

Hive tyrant- I've only played him deepstriking and with wings (the only other option would be with tyrant guard and some firepower I'm assuming) and in this format I find him to be incredibly overpriced if you only look at his raw statline. But is really much more than that. Paroxysm has saved my ass against th/ss terminators (which walk through our MC's like nothing) and leech life is a godsend when my opponent doesn't roll as well as he expected, and then I annoyingly get back some wounds. Dual scything talons are great against pretty much anything.

Zoanthropes- They usually end up being one-hit-wonders for me. They unfortunately are not reliable enough (if your opponent has psy-defense) to depend upon, but they are nice because they will attract your opponent's fire, and they do tend to at least suppress the vehicle (don't expect more than that). I of course run them in pod, and I don't see them being run effectively any other way.

Mycetic Spores- Their default gun is surprisingly good for supression fire, and if they do end up being the same size as a SM pod, then they will do cover wonders for your MC's. It annoys the piss out of the opponent when he has to fire at a pod to get rid of your cover. It also has to be clarified as to what happens if you tank shock a pod (fucking FAQ)

Hope this helps.

Chumbalaya said...

I'm not a huge Zoanthrope fan, but this I like Tyler.

What I do know from facing Trygons is that you can't just bring just 1. 1 Trygon, while impressive, is not going to do enough damage or endure enough fire to be useful.

I think I could a variation of my army with a Hive command Tyrant, Harpies to replace T-fexes, and throw Trygons in somebody's face. Harpies and HG suppress, Trygons munch.

Raptor1313 said...

That is way the hell off the wall (from my thinking) Tyler, but I think there's some merit. Assuming it works out as you say, though.

I definitely agree that you really need 2-3 Trygons to make it worthwhile, because most armies that can shoot can deal with one in one turn, and if they can't shoot it to death they're probably fine with assaulting it.

The other real list I'd been kicking around was something with double winged tyrants, then a large unit of gargoyles to screen a couple units of shrikes. army goes that way, hits things. Not sure what else it would have in it, though. It's something to point out.

Tyler said...

Do you care to elaborate how you think its 'hell off the wall'? I'm always curious as to what others think, and I will take it in to account, regardless whether I actually agree or not. lol

I think there are very few times that you can just take one of anything, and have it be worthwhile, to be honest.

The tyrants will be between 500-600 of your points, then around 200 for the gargoyles, and then 200ish for each shrike unit. So thats about 1k of your points alone. So you need anti tank, six hive guard (at least) if you want to start on the table, and at least a pair of zoanthropes if you want to reserve. (300 and upwards). Leaving you ~700 for troops, and as much more AT as you can get. Stelek has done a similar list to the idea, here's a link:

http://www.yesthetruthhurts.com/2010/01/beaus-flying-nids.html

what do you think?

Damon said...

Tyler beat me to it. My current list is the all deep-striking 'nids led by two hive commander flyrants. Our lists and tactical approaches are very similar. I only own one Trygon, so my other two Heavies are podded carnifexes for the same points. (And they're really not bad!)

I also trim my Troops budget compared to Tyler (just one tervi, who outflanks with his termagants, but I add in podded Warriors) to make room for Deathleaper, who is an absolute blast to play in this kind of list.

Here's another list I'd like to build someday, though it would require me to buy a bunch of models so it'll probably be a while. I call it "Double Flying Wing". It uses lots of models you apparently haven't yet, and is FAST.

HQ
[230 pts] Hive Tyrant, 2x scything talons
[230 pts] Hive Tyrant, 2x scything talons

Elite
[100 pts] 2 Hive Guard
[100 pts] 2 Hive Guard

Troop
[128 pts] 16 Hormagaunts, toxin sacs
[120 pts] 3 Warriors, 3x rending claws, 2x devourer, 1x venom cannon
[120 pts] 3 Warriors, 3x rending claws, 2x devourer, 1x venom cannon

Fast Attack
[120 pts] 15 Gargoyles, toxin sacs, adrenal glands
[120 pts] 15 Gargoyles, toxin sacs, adrenal glands
[200 pts] 5 Shrikes, scything talons, rending claws

Heavy Support
[265 pts] Tyrannofex, rupture cannon
[265 pts] Tyrannofex, rupture cannon

Total: 1998 pts

The points for the Shrikes could easily be repurposed if you wanted. I just think they're awesome. ;) That, and they fit the theme well.

Damon said...

Uh, just noticed there should be wings on those tyrants. [blush]

Raptor1313 said...

@Tyler
Mostly, it feels off the wall to me because I've not touched flyrants and drop pods.

Then again, nothing says you have to drop termagants in their pod, for example.